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The Resnick Interview with Peter Kawaja
and Ex-NSA Agent Joe Jordan

"Dead Men Tell No Tales"

Transcribed by Leading Edge Research Group -

Legend: PK (Peter Kawaja) NR: (Dr.Norm Resnick) JJ: (Joe Jordan) C: (Caller)

NR: My guest this hour is Mr. Peter Kawaja, who will be talking about the Gulf War Illness and terrorism. Pete, you're a big name in the country now, so take off in any direction.

PK: The terms "Gulf War Illness" and "Gulf War Syndrome" are misleading, in that they affect everyone in the United States, not just our veterans. This is a communicable disease that is affecting the civilian population as well. The first point I would like to make is that these are warfare agents that were used in the Persian Gulf war, and it affects your freedom, whether you will live or die. Whether it involves the "chip", the new national medical ID card, the constitutional issues that are going around, the Montana Freemen issue, or the recent downing of the aircraft carrying Ron Brown; it's everything and it's all tied together. We hear Terry Reed; we hear Mark Phillips and Kathy O'Brian; we hear everyone out there talking and saying basically the same thing: that we have one gigantic octopus and everything is connected! There is no such thing as coincidence, and all these things are tied to each other. This is tyranny and terrorism right here in the United States, and these crimes are being perpetrated against the American people. For anyone waiting for the fellow at the starting gate to fire his pistol and declare that the war is on, let me say that we are the enemies of certain individuals who have seized control of the American government.

NR: Peter, what's your take on the suicide of the Chief Medical Inspector of the airplane that Ron Brown was aboard, which just occurred on April 7th?

PK: It's interesting, isn't it? I'm sure that you are aware of the information that is being disseminated by the National Vietnam POW Strike Force?

NR: No.

PK: Well, let me say that the cadavers from the Ron Brown aircraft arrived at Dover AFB, Delaware, and they had traces of the chemical "thermite" on them. This is a chemical in bombs that are used to blow safes and bunker doors.

NR: How do you know this?

PK: That information was passed to me through Joe Jordan of the National Vietnam POW Strike Force, out of Houston, Texas. Joe Joran is a former National Security Agency (NSA) agent. In addition to that, Shelley Kelly , the flight attendant on the aircraft, walked onto the rescue helicopter with minor cuts and bruises. However, upon arrival at the hospital, it was found that she had bled to death on the way. They found a 3 inch incision over the femoral artery. I accept this information as solid, due to its source. Those listeners who know of Mr.Jordan and his organization understand that he has very reliable sources within the government. Perhaps we could conference Mr. Jordan in.

NR: We'll do that.

PK: I want to talk about the terrorism that is being perpetrated against people such as the Freemen of Montana, as well as others like myself. I may not make it to Thursday, as there may be a raid on my home.

NR: Why?

PK: Because of incidents that are taking place. I was almost charged with contempt by the judge in a court case recently. They tried to put me behind bars, and chances are that I would not have come out alive again.

NR: Joe Jordan is with us. Mr. Jordan, who are you?

JJ: I'm a Vietnam veteran, active in the Vietnam POW issue, and as a knee-jerk reaction, I'm interested in anything that exposes government wrong-doing and corruption. By the way, Pete, have you seen the list of companies that were represented on the Ron Brown plane? This should have been in the newspapers, this list of corporate leaders and the businesses they represented. I'm told that some of these companies are involved in the Tulley lawsuit in Texas, which involves the Gulf War illness issue.

JJ: Let me run some of the names by you to see if any of them jump out at you, as far as having anything to do with biological warfare:

o Riggs International Banking

o Asea, Brown and Bovert (ABB)

o Air and Water Technologies

o Parsons Corporation [Editor note: Involved in underground facility construction]

o Harza Engineering

o Bridge Housing Corporation

o Bechtel Europe [ Editor note: Involved in underground facility construction]

o Interguard Corporation

o Insearch International

o AT&T Submarine Systems

o Foster-Wheeler Energy

JJ: Any of these companies reach out and ring any bells with you?

PK: Yes, a couple of them certainly do, and I'll talk about you privately about them.

NR: Peter said that there were traces of thermite on the bodies recovered from the Ron Brown aircraft, and that attendant Shelley Kelly was alive and fairly well going into the helicopter. Is that correct?

JJ: That's correct. That's the information I got.

NR: From a good source?

JJ: A source that has been reliable in the past.

NR: Are you saying that Ron Brown's place was blown up and that Shelley Kelly knew what happened, and that she was subsequently killed on the helicopter flight?

JJ: The information that I acquired was from someone that was present at the autopsies, and who cannot be identified. My source related that there was a three to four hour difference between the original bruises, cuts and scratches and the 3" incision wound. This indicates that she was deliberately cut where she would subsequently bleed to death. Someone who was alive and conscious on that aircraft would have been aware of the circumstances as the plane was crashing. For example, she would have been able to say, "we were on normal approach, and all of a sudden there was an explosion, and then all of a sudden I was on the ground." Of course, the story that they want is that the airplane simply crashed -- and dead men tell no tales.

PK: Dr. Resnick, you need to know that Mr. Jordan is former NSA and has ties. I trust his information and his sources. There are many suspicious things about this airplane crash.

NR: Joe, what have you done with your information?

JJ: We have several fax networks that we utilize, as well as a good computer network.

NR: Have you contacted any government agencies?

JJ: Many times I do, but they get it anyway because my phone is heavily tapped by no less than 18 federal agencies. That's all part of the game.

NR: Is there any way for people to get in touch with you?

JJ: Sure. They can call me at 713-680-3181.

NR: Peter, where shall we go from here?

PK: The balance of what I will talk about is not conjecture. For those of you who have not heard from me, I will say that my information is not from some second-hand investigation; it was not passed on to me. I am not a federal agent, nor have I ever been one. However, I did operate on behalf of the U.S. government under a code name. My background is in security: 28 years in telephonics and in data acquisition and control. I have ties with the law enforcement community and with the U.S. military.

PK: The "Gulf War Syndrome" is a continuation of the biological warfare which has been tested not only on civilian populations over the years, but is an extension of Agent Orange and other types of testing. It shouldn't come as a surprise to the public that testing, research and engineering has been conducted for the ultimate "super weapon". You can look at this from either of two sides. On one hand, you can justify the development of biological warfare if you think that there are nations who are going to do it anyway, in defiance of the Geneva Convention and other laws. On the other hand, my investigation proves that biological agents were not only developed and used in the Persian Gulf war, but that they are in fact part of the Global 2000 population downsizing program. I can speak with authority on this, because of the evidence I have obtained. No one gave me the "spy handbook". I used my 28 years in security. I trained many of the agents and sold some of the spooks a lot of high-tech "toys" in the days of vector counter-intelligence and Ben Jamil. I go back many years with some of the players.

PK: I got involved with a project called "Product Ingredient Technology" in Boca Raton, Florida. I was also involved throughout the United States with IBI (Ishan Barbouti International), the builder of Pharma 150, the chemical and biological weapons complex in Rabta, Libya. From my investigation, I found a lot of things that were not legitimate, and I ran. I was green about a lot of these things upon going in. I went to the CIA and FBI, and operated for the U.S. government under a code name, because they said these people were international terrorists and that they were going to prosecute them. However, they did not count on me bugging telephone lines, buildings, and certain other locations throughout the United States. I intercepted the Commodity Credit Corporation, the Banca Nazionale del Lavorro (CCC-BNL), the letters of credit of the BNL, which came from Switzerland, as well as a lot of other communications regarding the Gulf War that was to come. I recorded calls going to and coming from Baghdad, to and from the United States and London, CIA, FBI, FBI counter-intelligence, U.S. Customs, certain politicians and numerous other individuals. This is my information. It is not second-hand.

PK: What I found at the PIT plant was very heinous. I found that a strain of hydrogen cyanide called Prussian Blue was being tested on gas mask filters more than 1 year prior to the Persian Gulf War. This information was known to the President of the United States, George Bush. It was arranged through Trevor Armbrister, a CIA asset and a Senior Editor of Reader's Digest, to fly me to the steps of the White House. Time does not permit me to tell my story, but the information that I want to get out to the American people is that the Gulf War illnesses are actually communicable diseases. The microbes will live almost indefinitely, but for a minimum of seven years. It's on the gas masks, the clothing, the weapons -- any of the materials brought back from the Gulf War. I have reports from several different states where civilians that bought some of the clothing went home and wore them, and now the entire family is in wheel chairs; there have been some deaths as a result of this.

C: Peter, is there any connection between this and "mad cow" disease and the wheat blight going on in Arizona?

PK: Mad Cow disease came out in Britain; however, a lot of this can be traced back to the Gulf War. We're not being told here in the United States that there is much more going on around the world. We are looking at a worldwide plague. It is not just the Gulf War veterans that have it; it is spreading around the world. A lot of the diseases that you're hearing about are not the result of natural causes; they are from the Persian Gulf war.

C: Why would they want to rub out those people on Ron Brown's plane?

JJ: Well, Ron Brown was a notorious person. He's had his finger in every crooked deal. He took a $700,000 bribe from Hanoi to get the trade embargo dropped. He was involved in the Denver International Airport boondoggle, which went about a billion dollars over budget. He was involved in the S&L scandal, Iran-Contra, and he was a big money runner for the Democratic Party. If you wanted any kind of permit from the government, you had to grease Ron Brown's palm and he would take care of the Democratic front runners. He was getting too big for his britches; he was a problem for the New World Order. He also blackmailed Clinton, and told him if he made him Secretary of Commerce or Secretary of State, that he would see to it that Jesse Jackson did not get involved in the 1992 election, and it didn't happen. Brown was a problem. Brown would have been suspicious if they had asked him to fly to Bosnia with a bunch of low-level munchkins. The big shots from the corporations were sacrificial "pigs". Brown figured that if big shots like Bechtel and ABB were on the plane, that surely they wouldn't shoot the plane down. Bosnia is a popular killing field for unpopular and unwanted political figures who have outlived their usefulness.

C: Concerning the status of the maintenance worker who "committed suicide" over the weekend, did CBS report that he was the head of maintenance for the radar at the airport where the plane was to land?

PK: That would be the engineer for navigational aids at Dibrovnik airport. Yes, they ruled his death a suicide. Ron Brown was also marketing vice president of U.S. Arms Company, which of course involved the Gulf War and the weapons that went to Iraq. It has to do with the Reigel Report. We have a massive plague with no known antidote out there, coming to your family. The U.S. discharged 489,000 of the 697,000 troops that served in the Persian Gulf. In Iraq, according to the Nicholson's, at least 1 million people are either infected or dead. As a general global figure, Dr. Nicholson states that approximately 20-25% of the populations in the Middle East are already affected. [Editor Note: It is no small coincidence that George Bush and James Baker, as well as others, were stockholders in the very same biotechnology companies that were responsible for the biowarfare weapons used in the Gulf that caused this worldwide plague to begin, is it?]